Robby Naish Interview

06 Mar 2008

Robby Naish won his first overall windsurfing world championship in 1976 at the age of 13. Since then he has won a total of 23 world titles. But competing wasn’t enough and in 1995 Naish International began making windsurfing sails and in 1999 expanded their product range to include kiteboarding products. The company has grown over the years to include all products for windsurfing and Kiteboarding, as well as a full line of surfboards. Interview by Rémi Forsans.


What challenges do you see for the surfing, skateboarding, and snowboarding business and how do you think they should be met?
Well, each business has its own unique challenges for sure, especially snowboarding which is very weather dependant. In surf and skate, the world is getting smaller and smaller through the internet, and at the same time you are able to expand your customer base hugely through this new media. This brings potential for problems and opportunities at the same time. It is a lot easier for small startup brands to get going today than ever before. The internet provides manufacturing sources worldwide, shipping and logistics, and an almost unlimited customer base for those willing to find them. This makes competition harder than ever.

In the hardware side of the industry, the retail landscape has changed dramatically. A shop territory used to be a few blocks, or maybe a town. Now a clever or aggressive shop can be selling to the entire world. The challenge for the industry is to balance this new form of information and business. Marketing dollars must be split. Print advertising is still important, but web-based marketing is also totally critical. So how do you balance the budget? Do you cut back on your print advertising? No. How do you just create new money to cover the new web marketing costs? When you figure it out, let me know!

What is your opinion about internet sales?
In the windsurfing and kiteboarding industry, they are really becoming a major issue. Not from the manufacturers directly, but from dealers who can easily send a product pretty much anywhere at a low cost. In kiteboarding, for example, you can send a kite, which may cost over a thousand euros, pretty much anywhere for fewer than fifty bucks by FedEx. So customers go online and do a lot of price shopping. At the end of the day it is hurting a lot of the “smaller” retailers that can not carry as much stock, and will [not] or cannot work on a reduced margin. The temptation for large shops (especially shops that are also distributors for smaller brands equating to a double margin on those products) to cut that margin to make a sale is very big. At the end of the day, this is shortening the shelf life of a product, promotes early closeout (as a shop does not want to be the last one to be stuck with last year’s stock), etc. The actual full-margin selling season for hardware has gotten very short. This has been detrimental to the old- fashioned shop which handles grass roots marketing and customer service that is vital to hardware. Customers will go online to save a few dollars on their big ticket items, then expect their local dealer to be there to handle customer service issues and sell them needed accessories. The shops will have a hard time surviving this way for long. In terms of a manufacturer or brand selling direct, at some point in time this seems inevitable in every industry.... good or bad.

Does this have any correlation to the mail-order business that, in my
opinion, killed windsurfing?
For sure the mail order and now internet business has hurt the retail landscape of mom and pop windsurfing shops. You need to touch and feel a product in a store. You need to learn how it works, and the do’s and don’ts. There is something very impersonal about online shopping. For an advanced customer this is no big deal, but at the entry and intermediate level, this is an important part of the industry vibe.

How can distributors better support independents to ensure this doesn’t happen to surf/skate/snow?
This is a tough one. It is hard if not impossible to “control” retailers. You also want your bills paid. That combination of things favours the bigger, better financed shops that do large volumes and can weather the ups and downs of good and bad seasons better than a smaller hardcore shop that lives hand to mouth. From a distributor’s point of view, it is easier to deal with one big client in an area than five little ones that are constantly struggling. On the flip side, it is scary for a distributor to have so much at stake with one customer. I would say that a distributor has to support the cottage industry, grass roots shops... even if it means splitting up product lines between a “mass market” and “hardcore” product that is sold through different retail channels; one smaller and exclusive to the hardcore shops and customers, and one available to the mainstream shops and less core customers.
 
What are your opinions on Chinese production?
Every region of the world has its specialty. It is hard to categorise that a Chinese product is A and a Thai product is B and a Turkish product is C and an Algerian product is D and so on. As China grows and westernises, it is rapidly becoming a more expensive place to do business. Still there are things made there that are of great quality and good value. At Naish, we produce most/all of our technical soft goods hardware in China, and are extremely happy with the history of our business dealings and product quality. In all industries, there is good and bad Chinese production, that is for sure.
 
What is your advice to independent retailers on how to compete with the big box?
Know your customer better than them. Find a niche. Be smart, stay fresh, and move quickly. Big guys can not move quickly.
 
The big surf brands are aggressively expanding distribution beyond independents, yet the independents have invested so much in promoting these brands that it’s difficult for the stores to drop the big lines and move on to smaller brands. What is your advice to independents on this?
You may need both. The “big brands” especially the smart ones like Quiksilver know their customer, and where they come from. Most of them are still run by surfers and snowboarders, and skaters, (though they are now surrounded by businessmen and accountants that keep them from making really stupid mistakes) and for sure do not want to lose touch with those retailers and core customers. You may want to take some risks as a retailer and bring in a smaller brand or two. You still want to stick with someone like Quiksilver though, as they are doing the marketing that will bring customers to your store, with a clear and targeted marketing campaign, and a dependable product that is of a quality and delivery timing that you can live with. Most little guys come and go, for good reason. So [as] long as you are smart at picking the hot young brand that will not keep you stranded or sitting on lame product that nobody wants, go for it. That is the difference between a good retailer and a bad one, I guess. You can also merchandise smartly with the big brands. In my Maui shop (Naish Maui Pro Center) for example, we are basically a hardgoods store, and therefore only carry the best SKUs of boardshorts, lycras and T-shirts. I know that if a guy wants some jeans or a dress shirt, he is not coming to my shop looking for it, and I will never have the selection to make him happy. On the other hand, he knows that I will have the hot boardshorts only, and he will not have to sort through the racks of elastic waistband dork shorts to find what he is looking for. Again, know your customer is my best advice.

What sales techniques can you suggest for retailers in order to better sell high-end product?
To sell high-end product you need high-end customers, or at least those that want to look like high-end customers. Active promotion and a knowledgeable staff are key elements. If your shop has the hot local riders, sponsors the local events, is involved in the local scene, and has an on floor staff that knows what they are talking about, you are pretty likely to be the hot shop for high-end product. Passion for the sport, not just for making money, becomes pretty obvious. You still want to have a business sense though, and not be so grass roots that the shop is a mess and you can’t pay your bills because you guys are all off riding every afternoon. People these days expect a certain presentation if they are going to lay down their cash.
 
What is your opinion about kitesurf market expansion?
It is still growing, but just how far it will grow is very hard to tell. Our sales at Naish are still brisk, but have levelled off from the growth of the early years. Much of this comes from the fact that there are now dozens of brands available, but also that the initial “trend customers” have already gotten into the sport.
 
Can you give us your feeling about paddle surfing?
I really see the standup market to be potentially huge. I do not see every surf spot being taken over by standup boards, (in fact that would suck) but the potential of the sport goes far beyond the waves and into a general outdoor fitness arena. I see standups on lakes and rivers worldwide.
 
What is the story of paddle surfing , how is that new boardsport born?
Paddle surfing has been around for a long time in Waikiki, it just never really took off beyond that occasional novelty. Now with more influential surfers doing it, and especially with standup-specific boards being made, the attraction has grown. It gets people out on the water that may or may not have been water people before. It also for sure makes crappy little waves a lot of fun. I would say that today the market is only a couple thousand boards worldwide, but that number is growing exponentially. For sure at Naish we are seeing huge demand coming from all over the world, not just from surf markets.

Is paddlesurfing the 21st century’s boardsport in your opinion?
Boardriding is a phenomenon. It has never been more popular than today. Everybody wants to skate, or surf, or ski, or kite, wake or windsurf. Standup adds another dimension and option to the list, and one that is very accessible and can be taken at one’s own pace. It is another way for hardcore boardriders like myself to make the best of available conditions (I skateboard, snowboard, tow surf, kiteboard, surf, longboard, windsurf, and standup) while at the same time allowing non-extreme athletes a way to get on a board, get out on the water, and get some great exercise with or without any waves. 
 
Last question: where do you see Naish Industry in 10 years?
You never know what the future holds. Hopefully we will still be making great boardriding products and having a blast riding them. That’s my plan anyway.